Boy to Man

My, my, my, how far some people can travel in four years. The first time I interviewed Ronan Keating he was just one of five young hopefuls desperately practising his dance-steps and vocal scales on a Sunday afternoon in the PoD nightclub in Dublin. That combo, of course, was Boyzone, and Ronan, then just seventeen, was brimming with positive energy and, as he might say himself, "full-on" focused on his dream of becoming a pop star.
Today, a few months beyond his twenty-first birthday, he arrives for this interview in a Peugeot 406. He parks the car near my apartment and only two hours later tells me, "Yvonne is asleep, down in the car, we just flew into Dublin on an early flight."
That's Yvonne, as in Connolly, one of Ireland's new breed of models and - even more newly, Ronan Keating's wife. Inevitably, the tabloids have been filled with tales of the couple's recent marriage, as well as stories about the death of Ronan's mother from breast cancer and his supposed nervous breakdown. However, back on terra firma in Ireland, he's far more interested in the news that, apart from the fact that Boyzone's latest single 'All That I Need' has topped the charts, their new album, Where We Belong, is their third in succession to enter the British charts at number one.
Clearly, Ronan's commitment to his career hasn't diminished one millimetre. Indeed, in the aftermath of his mother's death, Ronan Keating now speaks of his career and music as if they were emotional imperatives, a sense that was not in evidence four years ago. This makes him seem much older than his years. He also happens to be one of the most popular performers in Ireland among his peers, to judge from the response of those who were present at his twenty first birthday party. Even hardline rock critics, many of whom mocked the band in the beginning, have now hopped on board.
But then few can deny that Boyzone are, by far and away, the most successful band in the history of Irish pop. And they are likely to hold that title for quite some time to come even though, inevitably perhaps, those same tabloids newspapers are frequently filled with tales about the "break-up" of Boyzone. But first let's focus on the question of whether or not Ronan Keating recently did have a nervous breakdown.

Joe Jackson: How the hell are you? One of your "friends" recently sold a story to the tabloids claiming he saw you crack-up.
Ronan Keating: I didn't have a breakdown. That story is crap. I was feeling low, rock-bottom, basically. The world and its friends were on my back. I needed to take time out. I'd come back to work too soon after what happened to my mother. I shouldn't have. I should have taken time to realise what was going on in my head. So I told the boys I had to take a break. And it was a big move for me because we had Top of The Pops the next day. That's not something I'd normally do, because my career is very important to me. But I had to.
So, those descriptions of you weeping in front of the lads, a doctor needing to give you medication, how true are they?
I was upset, sure, but Christ, there was no medication.
No tranquillisers? Around your age Presley turned to that kind of medication to ease the pain after his mother died.
I know that. But no, I didn't. I hope I never do, God willing. But the whole thing was that when me mam died I hadn't taken time to even think about it, much less try to understand what I was feeling deep inside. Everybody came around to the house and everything was just a blur to me. It was just everyone walking around, drinking and I never even sat down, by myself, to focus on things. So I'd just be reckoning my mother was in another room or downstairs. I never really understood why the whole thing was going on, to tell you the truth.
But when everyone went home and you were left alone on that terrible first night after the funeral, did you feel it then?
For moments. But I never really let it grab hold of me. Then, as time went by, I was back at work and I'd be sitting in hotel rooms and I'd realise "Oh my God, what's happened?" And I'd just cry out. That's when I said "Listen, lads, I have to take some time out, even for a couple of days."
Anyone who has lost a mother, or father, will recognise the truth in what you said somewhere about how, when you got to the hospital and rushed towards the door into the room where she'd just died, time seemed to stand still. All you remember is your hand frozen on that door handle for what seemed like an eternity.
Big time, man, definitely. I remember looking at my hand, every line, every crack, every nail on my fingers, noticing the colour, if there was dirt on a nail, whatever. And it did seem to take forever to open that door, though, literally, it took only half a second, because, naturally enough, I was trying to get into that room as quickly as I could.
So what do you think was happening at that moment?
They say your life flashes before you at times like that, all the emotions you ever felt. I definitely know that twenty-one years of my life with my mother flashed before me, in the time it took me to grab that door handle. And maybe it is, y'know, your heart telling you to shut down, prepare yourself for what you're about to see. But I'll tell you one thing. That moment is something I'll never forget and I hope I never have to go through anything like that again. And even worse was when I finally walked into the room and saw my sister. Linda, and Ciarain, my brother, there with mam. She looked peaceful, at last, which was a relief, but I still felt so much pain and anger I just wanted to explode. I couldn't deal with it at all.
At first, when you got the phone message from Blanchardstown Hospital, I gather all you were told was that your mom had "taken a turn for the worse" but by the time you got there, the nurse was telling you, "Ronan, your mother passed away fifteen minutes ago."
Yeah. That's how things happened. I'd leapt out of bed, dressed, left Yvonne at her parents' house - she was still in her pyjamas - and drove at about 120 miles an hour to the hospital. But I had this dream the night before mam died - or on the morning, just four hours before she died. In the dream she was sitting in a corner, dressed in gold, and myself and Linda, my sister, were there and my mom says, "Listen guys, I'm gone now. Let me go." And at that point I actually did wake up to Linda opening the door of my bedroom and saying, "It's half six I'm going to the hospital." Then Yvonne woke up and I said, "I just had a dream that mom died." And a couple of hours later the phone rang with the nurse saying, "Your mother took a bad turn, get your father, your sister." But I couldn't get in touch with anyone on their mobiles, or whatever. Not even Linda. In fact, mam had asked Linda to go out and get slippers for her. But mam didn't need slippers. She had slippers.
Why do you think she asked Linda to get her slippers?
Because she didn't want anyone around. She knew it was time. She'd prayed the night before for God to take her. It was "Take me, take me, I've had enough of this." And I questioned that, questioned God, as in asked Him: "Why give her that pain, she was such an incredible woman? Why put her through that?" Okay, He took her out of it in the end, but why give her such pain in the first place? She didn't deserve it. She gave us everything we ever wanted, as a family. She hadn't got a bad bone in her body. My mam shouldn't have been put through all that pain.
At times like that a lot of us lose our faith because we can't answer the question "why?", apart from having to say "there is no God, there can't be." Didn't you do that?
Yeah. I'm sure I lost it. For an hour or two.
And clenched your fist at God?
Well, I definitely stood in my room and screamed to high-heaven, "Why"? But half an hour later I'd sit back down and say, "Mam doesn't want me to be this way. She wouldn't want me to lose my faith. She wants me to believe this all happened for a reason." And that's how I now feel about it. Whenever there was a question in my life, mom always gave me the answer.
What about your dad?
He's gone through a hard time in all this.
But, because of your loss, could you be accused of neglecting him, focusing too much on your mom?
To be honest, me and my mam were something special. We were, how do I say this without getting . . . (fumbles for words). We were everything to each other. We knew each other's thoughts. She'd say "Ro, don't lie to me because I know when you're lying". And she'd be right. She was everything to me. I can't explain it. Her touch. (Ronan begins to cry, lightly, fights tears). Whereas with my dad, it was always "go on out there and play football, win at athletics", whatever. It was never emotional. He never showed us much love. Even now he can't. He doesn't know how. It's not his way. But I am trying with him. I do try. I give him every chance I can.
So is there a distance between you and your dad?
There always has been.
So maybe your sensitivity comes more from your mom, maybe she formed the more feminine side of your nature which, she might argue, is the part of you that makes music.
I'd say that is true, yeah. And that does all come from being brought up by my mother and the fact that she always believed in me. At first, as I told you before, she wanted me to stay at school, but when she realised how much music means to me she said, "Go for it, Ro." In fact, she's given me everything I am. I am her. I am of her. She has made me what I am today. I believe that totally. And she did build up my confidence by saying, "Whatever you touch would turn to gold, Ro. Whatever you want to do, you will do it." In that sense I was totally spoiled. I wouldn't have admitted that to you four years ago, but I will now!
You got upset there a moment ago, talking about your mom. Obviously you realise that going away for a few days is far from enough to help you deal with her death?
I went away to try and deal with it and while I was away I realised I'll never deal with what happened. That was the answer. But I only could have learned that, by going away. The pain may get a little bit less, easier to handle, but it's something I'll never let go. And, to be honest, I don't want the pain to ever go away, because I don't want my mother to go away.
But, Ronan, surely your mother wouldn't want you to feel pain just so you can stay in touch with her presence?
Well, maybe it's not so much 'pain' I'll feel, as much as a constant awareness of the fact that she has gone from my life. I now know I have to accept that in this life, while I'm on this earth, I'll never see my mam again.
But you believe you'll see her beyond this life?
Absolutely. She's making me believe. That's my mother.
And you also believe she stopped the rain on your wedding day?
Yeah! (laughs) And I'll never forget Gary saying to me, "Do you think mam's going to let it rain on the day you get married? Are you stupid?" He's standing there with a golf club in his hand and I say, "No, Gary, but it's raining!" Then a half hour before the wedding, the sun burst out from behind the clouds! And as we were going through the rows of houses, to get married, I could feel my mom's presence right there beside me. I knew this was her way of saying, "I'm giving you the sunshine, this is my blessing on your wedding day."
Do you think she'd give her blessing to the marriage itself?
Yeah. Because my mom made me make the moves I made. She met Yvonne and that's what happened.
You believe your mom wanted you to marry Yvonne so soon after her death?
No. I mean that I introduced Yvonne to mam and mam told me she liked her a lot, loved her. But she never said, "Go ahead and get married."
Even so, you did tell your mom you were sure Yvonne was the woman you'd been waiting for.
Yeah, I told her how I felt about Yvonne.
But she didn't say "go ahead and get married".
No. Because mam never wanted to say "Goodbye". That would have been too final for her. It would be like, "I'll be gone . . ." or "If I go . . ." whatever. The only thing I do remember is sitting on the bed two weeks before (her death) and she held my hand and said, "Ro, listen. Whatever happens to me I want you to continue with what you do. Don't ever stop. Because this is what you are best at. And it's something you can do for the rest of your life." And having my mam say that to me, meant a lot to me. Though it was horrible, sitting there when she was telling me that. The two of us bawling our eyes out, because I didn't want to hear what she was saying. I, myself, like her, didn't want any kind of goodbye.
What's your response to those who say you married Yvonne too soon after your mom's death, that you may see her mostly as a substitute mother
Whatever, that means as much to me as Yvonne does. But, of course, whatever I grabbed after mam's death people'd say "oh it's a substitute." They'd say that if I turned to drugs, anything. But this is something I wanted to do for a long time with Yvonne. We were best friends, above and before all this. That was the foundation, before there was any sort of a relationship. There was a group of us, we had drinks together and that's how it started out, though I knew her since I was ten, and she was thirteen. But then around the middle of last year I realised it was either say goodbye to her or tell her how I really feel about her. And I told her and she said she felt the same way.
Was she surprised?
She was surprised I said it but not surprised I felt that way!
Why would she be, Ronan? She read the first interview we did and realised you are an out-and-out romantic!
Fuck off, you bollix! Okay, then, so I can sue you if it all goes wrong! But, seriously, people can say what they like. I got married for the right reasons. Because I love Yvonne and want to spend the rest of my life with her. People can read into that what they like. We did this for each other, not for what anybody else wants. That's it, at the end of the day. I really can't say anything more. Only time will show how we really feel about each other. When we're still together in fifty years, people will say "I'm sorry I said that about your marriage, sorry I misread it, at the start."
So are you wounded by this notion, which seems to have dominated the media, that you got married for the wrong reasons?
No. Because I never read the papers. I laugh at what they do. As long as they don't effect the people around me. As long as Yvonne doesn't get hurt, or my family.
Has Yvonne been hurt by what's been written about you and her?
At the beginning, yeah. She's not used to this. Whereas after four, five years in this business, I am. So, God love her, I felt so sorry for her. In fact, at one point I had to take her away, because it wasn't fair what the papers were saying about us. That was straight after the marriage, when we came back here and they were all putting forward their views on why I married. I just said to Yvonne, "Feck them, rise above it, all they want to do is sell a fifty pence paper. They don't care about our feelings."
Did Yvonne feel they were belittling her feelings for you?
Totally. And it's not fair on her because she truly loves me. And she wants to tell people she loves me, just as I want to tell people I love her. But we can't, because there is all that shit from people who claim to "really" know why we married. They don't. Only Yvonne and I know. For sure.
You guys looked pretty close that night of your twenty-first birthday, when you hugged on stage in the Red Box, as if you were almost defiantly introducing her to the world, saying, in public, "This is the one".
I was saying that. I'm telling you, Joe, I've never really had a full-on relationship, like I had with Yvonne before we married. And I did drive her to that party, on the back of the bike, and that was like "Here we go, this is it", because I knew the cameras were there, the Press. I was saying, basically, "She's the one for me".
So, you came out of the closet that night?
We both came out of the closet!
Careful Ronan! You did become one of Ireland's top "gay icons" recently, whether that means gays just fancy your ass or admire you as a "really nice" person.
Either way, that's cool. I love it. I've no problem with that, at all.
Really? I know at least one young woman who said she'd love to "ride you ragged" but she also said your "I am a virgin" claim was a cover-up for homosexuality!
I got married a few weeks ago, so tell her to wake up!
Wake up, yourself, Ronan! We all know that for many gays marriage is a cover-up! Besides, the same woman would probably say Yvonne is really a man!
There you go (laughs)! It's all a cover-up. I really am gay. My God!
But, seriously, in terms of this much-mocked "I am a virgin" claim, Georgina Dodrill has claimed, in one newspaper article that you lost your virginity to her at 17. Yet you rejected that claim.
Of course I did.
Don't lie to me, Ronan!
May God strike me dead, on this spot! I swear, on my mother's grave that story is crap. She obviously needed a couple of quid.
Either way, Georgina claims you had full sex with her when you were seventeen.
God love her! She wishes!
If what she says is true, you've been lying to us all for years.
Then I've been lying to myself, too!
So don't you want to clear the record on all this?
I'm a married man. And I said what I said, from day one, about being a married man.
That you would retain your virginity until married?
I am a married man.
But you didn't retain your virginity, Ronan.
How do you know?
Gut instinct. Earlier this year, you turned up in RTE one Sunday morning with Gabrielle Martinek, an MTV presenter, and I somehow suspect you and she hadn't been at Mass beforehand! Apart from that you had other high-profile "romantic" relationships.
I saw other people but there was no full-on relationships like I've had with Yvonne.
No "full-on" sex?
By no means.
What does that mean, Ronan?
It means no. No, I'm saying no! I'm just not that type of person. I don't want to share myself, like that, with people, unless I know for sure. Okay, everybody makes mistakes in their lives and goes a little bit too far but, by no means was there full sex.
But you did "make mistakes" sexually, went too far with some women?
Everybody makes mistakes.
Are you really that true to your romantic-religious-family roots, as passed on to you by your mother?
I try my best to be. Honest to God, Joe. And my mother did always say, as I told you earlier, "Don't lie because I will find out if you are lying" and I still think that's true.
So, you're saying you went so far, sexually, with these other women, then drew back.
Of course.
But it's not necessarily "of course", Ronan. As a male of twenty-one you are obviously the exception if you didn't have full sex. And I don't only mean in relation to being a member of Boyzone, a "heart-throb" for thousands of women.
Maybe. But I have tried to be true to what I am and what I believe - though, as I say, there were times I went too far. Yet I have saved myself and I'm happy to have done that. In fact, I'm very proud of what I've done, even if, y'know, you'll always get eejits telling stories of how "I did it with him." But that is because I am in the public eye and people love to get their face in the paper! Yet so far, the only story of that kind is the one you mention, thank God.
So no other woman has sold her story about having had sex, "full-on" or otherwise, with Ronan Keating?
No. That's the only one I know about.
And this sexual relationship, with Yvonne, within the context of marriage is real.
In every sense, totally. And I mean it when I say I'm not going to make a liar out of myself. I have had no full-on, y'know.
What? Consummation, sexually?
(Mumbles) Whatever.
I would assume you have now, though?
Assume all you like! I'm not going to say. That's our private life, Joe.
Ronan, don't be so coy! Surely one can safely assume that when people are newly-married, they have a consummated sexual relationship!
Okay, yeah, especially if you're going to have children!
So if a child arrives we shouldn't be surprised!
No. But it won't be this year. Maybe next year. Let's get over the wedding first! Yet I do love children, and Yvonne does too.
You do seem to feel you've been blessed by meeting Yvonne.
I have been. I've never been happier. And I do feel my mom is pulling all the strings, that she gave me Yvonne, definitely.
Okay, so apart from being a husband and maybe next year becoming a dad, what about Boyzone? Do you really believe, as you said recently, that there is another two years left for the band? Surely the four to five years of glory you've had is as much as any "boy-band" can expect?
Maybe you're right. And I'd love to think we could go on and do another ten albums but the truth is that we're getting old. Mike is 26 this year! Yet I don't like to focus on this question because me and the lads never even talk about it. Besides, everywhere I go, in Europe, it seems the only question is, "When is Boyzone breaking up."
Would the prospect of Boyzone making it in the States be enough to keep the band together for two years?
Absolutely. And America is going to take us on. They reckon we're going to be bigger than New Kids On The Block. As in, the record company, the guy who launched Hanson, really does believe that.
I've heard that you, personally, have had at least seven substantial offers of solo deals, so wouldn't it be fair to say that if there wasn't this apparent potential for Boyzone in America, you might have gone for one of those deals?
I'm still getting those offers and I let the boys know that. And I will tell them when it's time for me to move on. But at the moment we're doing better than ever before, so why would we want to give it up?
Take That broke up when they were at a peak. Geri recently left Spice Girls.
I know. And I know Spice Girls. I haven't seen them in a long time but they were never happy doing what they did. It was all too much for them, from day one. Whereas we grew, started off touring Ireland in a white transit van, then slowly worked our way to this level. But Spice Girls broke through almost immediately and were going full tilt from the beginning, because of pressures from their management. Then, when they got rid of the management, it seems they lost the run of things.
Do you think Spice Girls have the potential for solo careers?
I see some of them going into movies and television, but not music. The only one who I think could go on in music is "Sporty" Spice, Mel. The rest, like Mel C will go into TV, Geri may go into movies and as for "Posh" Spice, she seems to be set up for life and probably just wants to have a family. I can appreciate that, because, as I said earlier, I want a family. But apart from that, I definitely want to do something after all this. You're right. I do have six, seven offers, from all the major labels in the world. I'm blown away by that. Because, as you know, I started off five years ago and all I wanted was to write music and walk into a record store and see my face, with the rest of the boys, on a single or album. Now I have more than half a dozen of the world's top record labels chasing me! It's mad!
But I also know how close you and, say, Keith and Stephen are. Doesn't the thought of moving on without them terrify you? They are, in a way, your second family.
I know that. And I can't imagine travelling the world without Duster (Keith) or Steo (Stephen) or any of the boys. That idea does scare the hell out of me. Even when we're home we hang out. We are like brothers.
Yet isn't it inevitable that Boyzone will eventually split and you'll move on without them?
One day. But not in the next year or two. As I say, we're all very happy, at the moment.
But when you say "I have six or seven offers", the other guys in Boyzone must feel jealous as fuck. Or fearful, thinking, "If Ronan goes, the whole thing will fold." You've just broken down the future potential for individual members of Spice Girls. Do you want to do the same thing for the guys in Boyzone?
I'm sure they are jealous, to whatever degree, but I don't want to think about that. Yet there is a life for every one of us after Boyzone. In, or outside, the music business. Shane wants to race cars. Other people want to do TV, solo deals, act on stage. There is a road for all of us, and it's not a dead-end road, believe me. But all I want to do is this: music. I love music.
It's also what your mother told you to stick at.
So no one's gonna move me! But right now I'm not out there looking for a solo deal. I've been offered the chance to present this BBC TV show and I may do that, but I didn't ask for that, they came to me.
Even so, I hear you've had meetings with American record companies about your solo career.
I've sat down with them to see what they had to say. Because, sadly, to tell you the truth, I feel it's a bit late now for Boyzone. We could have been there before Spice Girls, Hanson, grabbed that market. But the record company didn't know what to do with us. Polydor, Ireland and the UK. We wanted to go. I was pushing, asking every week 'Why aren't we going? An Irish boy band in America? It'd be perfect." But, that said, we are different from other boy bands. We write our own stuff, co-produce it, play live so maybe there still is a chance for us.
Have you and the lads sorted out your "difficulties" with Paul Keogh, of Polygram, Ireland - all that stuff about Boyzone moving to London?
I don't care. I don't want to know. He's back on the scene with this Kerri Ann thing. He brought forty journalists over from England, flew them over first-class, for that? What's going on there? We had to put our first single on the shelves ourselves. He wouldn't give us our gold discs. He was being childish. And we were young kids, they meant more to us than anything. A disc up on our wall! And he wouldn't give them to us because he'd had an argument with Louis (Walsh, manager). That's childishness. But I haven't talked to him for years. And there was a lot of bitchiness when we did move out. Some people were going "Don't leave us" but if they knew why we did, they'd understand.
Boyzone also took a lot of flak in the media, with people saying you were going to take all the profits out of this country, not aware it was just the operational base you were moving to London.
Absolutely. Look (picks up CD of Where We Belong , points to publishing credits) 'The copyright of this sound recording is owned by Polygram, Ireland.' So, there you have it. We just needed to get away from the madness that went on in that building over there (gestures towards offices of Polygram). But there was no uprooting of anything. We all still live, pay taxes here, the lot. And I'll always stay here, because I love Ireland.
Do you still love Louis? Are you guys still best friends?
Absolutely. He'll sit me down and we'll talk about songs and sometimes fight but he's still our manager and he'll always be my manager, long after Boyzone. And it's not about money. It's that he loves music, loves the bond we have together, the buzz , being 'Louis Walsh, manager of Boyzone, top pop band in Ireland.'
But is it reasonable for you to assume that all these offers from the States, for you to go solo, mean they want Louis to be there beside you, as your manager? They may have someone they think can be of better benefit to you in the States.
Maybe they will but I won't do it without Louis. Maybe we'll need help, from other management people, but Louis and I will still be together, as a team. I need him. I know him. I phone and he's being distant and I say "Okay, what the fuck is wrong with you?" and he'll say "Nothing" but then he'll call me a half hour later and say "You little bollix, how did you know?" And, as for me, we don't have to go through all that because he can tell, almost immediately, from the tone of my voice, whether or not there is something wrong with me. That's how close we are. And I'm not about to let that go, for anyone, or anything.
So how does he feel about the fact that, from what I've heard, you've become a wino!
Feck off, will ya? I love wine but not in the sense that I have to drink twenty bottles, at a fiver a throw, down the side of the supermarket! I have one bottle over dinner with a friend, or Yvonne.
So does Ronan Keating, our working-class hero, who has since become a "wine snob", have a recommended wine?
Chateau Lascombe! It's a lovely red, kind of dry. But, you're right, I have become a bit of a snob because Boyzone do travel around the world and stay in the best hotels and get the best food and drinking good wine is part of that. But at least I'm not throwing forty bottles of whiskey a night into myself. Or drugs. Yet I do like the good things in life. I go round these hotels, see something about the decor and think, "I must do that with the house". And Peugeot gave me a 406 Coupé, a beautiful machine, the kind of car I've wanted all my life.
So these are the hidden perks of being a pop star?
Damn right! We were over in Gucci last weekend and they gave us shirts, jeans, jackets, the lot! And all they ask is that you be seen wearing the clothes, which is fine by me, because Gucci is one of my favourite labels.
What about "designer" drugs like cocaine? You swore, four years ago, you'd never use them. Have you stayed true to that pledge?
I have. I swear to God. I don't know what cocaine tastes like and don't care.
Surely you see it all the time in the pop world?
Of course. You walk into parties and it's just there, on the tables. But when I do see it I walk out the other door, as quick, because I don't want anything to do with drugs. And I've chosen to be with friends who don't do drugs, like Brian Kennedy and Gary Barlow. Or I go out with Larry, from U2, and we don't have to see any of that crap. I don't need to hang out with the people who do cocaine. It's not my style.
Has anyone else in Boyzone fallen prey to the lure of cocaine?
We all love drink. "Duster" and myself go for a drink in the Dockers, a pint of Guinness, but that's it, I swear. I honestly have kept away from drugs. Totally. And if anyone else in Boyzone is doing drugs I don't want to know about it. One of the reasons my mother didn't want me in a band was because she was afraid of all the drink and drugs. So I promised her I'd never go overboard. And I won't. Though I was terrified I might go off-the-rails when she died. But, thank God, Yvonne helped me keep my feet on the ground. And my family did. So I'm not going to do anything stupid now. Even so, I always did believe that when my mam died I'd never be able to deal with it, that I'd crack up, be in a clinic, slapping my head off a wall, strapped up in a straitjacket. I honest to God thought that's what'd happen to me. And there were times I did hit the wall, I admit.
Your commitment to Boyzone must have kept you grounded, as well.
It did. Likewise, when I got that Ivor Novello award for 'Picture of You'. That's something I've dreamed about for years, getting an award for songwriting in a room where you have people like Sting and Elton John! I can't ask for a greater honour than that. Because songwriting is the one thing, in terms of a boy band, that everyone laughs at, saying "They're not songwriters at all." Well, I just picked up an Ivor Novello award, so people who say things like that can just ffff-fill in the blanks! Without being cocky, that award makes me feel really, really, proud. From the beginning people were saying "Oh, Boyzone can't even write their own songs" and maybe, in the beginning, we couldn't. But now I feel I could walk into a room with any producer in the world and write a song with them. I'm going over to LA to work with Diane Warren and I could do the same with Babyface because, now, I really do have the confidence to do that, whereas before, I didn't. Last week I was working with "Mutt" Lange and Shania Twain. Four years ago I couldn't have done that without being a naive, stupid little child.
But do you need a co-writer like Ray Hedges, who not only co-wrote a lot of Boyzone songs but also, it seems, is the mastermind behind B*witched.
I don't need one. 'I'm Learning', Parts One and Two, are two songs that came directly from me, but there is fine tweaking producers do, which is why you see their names on the albums. I have worked with Ray Hedges and Martin Brannigen, the three of us are quite a tight writing team. In fact I feel, in my case, it's like Bernie Taupin and Elton John. Elton couldn't write a thing until Bernie came along. I sometimes feel like that, though I have been writing lines and lines and lines about my mother and maybe one day they'll work their way into a song. Later in life, when I have a solo career. Though 'This Is Where I Belong' on the new album is about my family life and the family my mother gave us and where I belong, basically. But that was written two years ago.
Tell me about some of the other songs on the new album, tracks you were more directly involved in writing.
'Must Have Been High' I wrote with Steve Lipsom, who's worked with Simple Minds and it's just a light-hearted song, like "Jaysus, I must have been mad to let you go". And 'That's How Love Goes', again, I wrote with Lipsom, and it's about falling in and out of love, thinking "This is it" until finally, you meet someone where you have to say "This is the one". But that's not so much about my own life as, say, 'While The World Is Going Crazy', which I wrote during the middle of last year when I was beginning to realise I loved Yvonne. And that really is how I feel about her, and the world we have, away from the music business.
'I'm Learning Part One' which I mentioned earlier, is basically about a guy singing goodbye at one point in life, to a girl, knowing he has to leave, sorry it has to be that way, telling her he believes there'll be another love but not sure. Then 'I'm Learning Part Two' is four years later, he's saying "How are you now? Who are you with? Have you moved on?" It's partly about me, because, when I was seventeen I did think I knew it all. Now, at twenty-one, I look back and realise I knew fuck all! In fact, 'I'm Learning' wasn't going on the album, but I said "I want it on the album, I'm really proud of that song". And I am.
Are there any tracks on the album you hate?
Yeah. 'One Kiss At A Time.' I sing it and co-wrote it but I was given half a song and had to finish it.
That sounds like someone else is dictating terms, maybe Polydor imposing songs on the band because they own the publishing.
That can happen. It's going on with the next single. 'And I' is the single we want, but they don't. They want 'Will Be Yours.' But we're fighting them. But I haven't felt that way about any other singles, except maybe 'So Good' which I cringe at now because of the sound of my voice, the lyric. But the rest I'll stand over. Same with this album, I think it's the most mature work we've ever done.
When we first talked you said one of your dreams was to become a millionaire so you could buy your mom a stud farm, in Kildare, I think it was. Is that what money means to you, that kind of freedom?
Yeah. And she got it. And just a few weeks before she died, mam said to her sister, "This is all I ever wanted". So the fact that being in Boyzone enabled me to do that for me mam, even if she didn't live long enough to enjoy it fully, means my dream did come true. But we're not totally financially secure. Sure, we're no longer paying debts to the record company but we're still owed money. And I have to pay the mortgage on the house in Kildare. I still can't afford to own me house! And, to tell you the truth, I'd be afraid that when we try to break into the States we'll be in the back seat again, financially. They'll need millions to launch us and we'll have to absorb the cost of all that. Maybe we could lose all the money we made!
But as things are, you guys in Boyzone are millionaires, on paper.
On paper, but, by no means in pocket!
Even so, you must know that there are countless rock fans, maybe readers of Hot Press, who despise you and everything Boyzone stands for, think you are all talentless bastards and are probably, at this point, starting to write their little letters to the magazine, railing against the fact that you were on the cover.
Feck them! No, maybe I shouldn't say that. Everyone to their own tastes. But I have watched all that turn around. Like I told you years ago, at first, when we came home from, say, doing the Smash Hits awards show in Britain, we'd get the local guys giving us the two fingers, shouting across the road, "You're nothing but a bunch of faggots, anyway." So what do they say now? "You're nothing but a bunch of rich, married men?" No. They walk over and shake our hands, I swear to God, Joe. All the time, young guys come up to me on the street, want to shake my hand and say "Fair play t'youse, what you're doing is great for Ireland." Even if they don't like the music! Fair enough.
And though I'm not saying Bono is God, or anything like it, when he says to me he admires us for what we do, I know we must be doing something right. Maybe it is more for other people like him to say than me, but I really do believe what he meant is that we have opened up the door for Irish pop, for bands like The Corrs, whoever, just like U2 did in terms of rock. And no one can take that away from Boyzone - even if they hate
our music. n