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my understanding of nama
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is that the 'property developers' are paying the money back on the loans to NAMA via the banks, but if that they default it's NAMA who ends up with the assets .
obviously what'll happen is that the developers will be going in and trying to get everything knocked down in terms of payments but who'll rule on that
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-- tricky
31/03/10 at 11:43
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 From :
number10
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Posted : 02/08/11 at 15:49 |
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I'm not sure that this is really about the developers. They took risks and I'm not saying that they should be able to walk away. But it is about the banks, and the part they played in inflating the value of property. And that is about the culture of bonuses based on loans made that prevailed in banks - which had them offering every Tom, Dick and Mary increased overdrafts, higher credit limits, loans and all the rest.
BTW, who exactly does own the other 51% of NAMA. I always assumed that it was State owned.
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 02/08/11 at 15:53 |
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17% is owned by Irish Life which is part of Permanent TSB
17% is owned by New Ireland – which is part of the Bank of Ireland Group
17% is owned by “major pension and institutional clients” of AIB Investment Managers
Source
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From :
number10
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Posted : 03/08/11 at 00:25 |
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What the fuck instrument was used to set that up? Did they get a piece of the action because they were 'supplying' bad loans?
And if they did, why didn't the other banks?
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 09/03/12 at 09:57 |
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Jesus Christ. These people are fucking insane. Is there no one in the media who can explain how wrong this is? Matt Cooper? Vincent Brown? Gene Kerrigan? Why the fuck is no one shouting stop?
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/nama-to-offer-risk-fre e-property-purchase-186594.html
Nama to offer risk-free property purchase
By Vincent Ryan
Friday, March 09, 2012
Nama is to lure people into the property market by ring-fencing them against any future fall in house prices.
Under the pilot incentive scheme that was announced yesterday, the agency said it would guarantee the mortgages of 175 properties in a bid to kickstart the housing market.
If the scheme is successful, it said it could be rolled out to up to 700 properties, including those in the North.
Nama chairman Frank Daly said the initiative was designed to push renters, who were on the verge of buying, over the threshold.
Mr Daly told the Oireachtas joint committee on the implementation of the Good Friday Agreement that he expected to offer the scheme to sell residential properties with protection against price falls "within months".
Under the scheme, interested parties will be asked to put a 10% deposit on a property. The buyer will then have to qualify for a 90% mortgage.
For the first five years of the mortgage, the buyer will make repayments based on the 90% mortgage.
After five years, the value of the property will be independently assessed. If the value has fallen by anywhere up to 20%, Nama will write that percentage of the mortgage off.
Mr Daly said the scheme will be rolled out to the wider market once it has been shown that it does not impact negatively on the property market.
"Clearance to roll the scheme out will be made if the pilot initiative works and doesn’t have a negative impact on the market."
The scheme is the latest move by the Government and state agencies to try to re-ignite the moribund property market.
The Government introduced mortgage interest relief at a rate of 25% in the last budget hoping to entice buyers into the market.
Another initiative being driven by Nama to help move the property market is vendor finance.
This would see the agency lending to commercial buyers at competitive rates. Drawing on its own capital reserve, Nama could offer loans to third parties at rates of 2.5% according to its chief executive, Brendan McDonagh.
Mr Daly said a lack of finance and unattractive borrowing conditions were issues in the commercial property market in both the Republic and the North, and that the agency’s decision to offer vendor finance was aimed at helping to address these issues.
Mr Daly said the agency was willing to talk to any potential buyer about providing debt finance for deals.
"If someone wants to talk to us about buying assets or loans we have vendor finance, we have staple finance, which we can provide if it’s the right deal, the right investment.
"Anybody interested should talk to us."
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From :
number10
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Posted : 09/03/12 at 11:36 |
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I love his language. This is designed to push renters who are on the verge of buying over the threshold.
There is an Alice in Wonderland aspect to everything than NAMA does.
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 09/03/12 at 11:56 |
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Real bullshit bingo alright.
“ring-fencing”
“pilot incentive scheme”
“kickstart the housing market” (the classic….first popularised in 2008 with the Home Choice Loan scheme….state backed sub-prime mortgages for people who can’t get sub-prime mortgages….yay!)
“rolled out”
“impact negatively on the property market” (translation: result in houses prices approaching house value)
“re-ignite the moribund property market”
“Entice buyers into the market” (I like this one because it sounds vaguely creepy…like enticing a child into a van or something)
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 09/03/12 at 12:13 |
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They’ll get the Communications Clinic on board before the official launch I’m sure.
There’ll be much more:
“The banks aren’t lending”, “Place a floor under the market”, “Restore confidence”, “Assistance for first time buyers”, “Start a family”, “A win-win situation”
….and much less:
“A jaysus lads, would ya not just buy a house, sher they’re great value, they can’t fall any further, ah c’mon, sher lookit I’ll even give you the money, here take the money, you can give it back to me whenever it suits, a jaysus, look….just buy the fuckin’ house you peasant”
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From :
ttemme
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Posted : 12/03/12 at 15:41 |
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| if i had started this thread i'd have headed it 'my misunderstanding of n'ma'.
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 30/03/12 at 10:44 |
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http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0329/anglo-promissory-payment.h tml
“The payment will now be financed through the issue of a long-term Government bond.
Mr Noonan said the move would allow wider discussions between the Government and the Troika on the structure of the promissory notes being used to fund IBRC.
Mr Noonan said the long-term bond would be financed for one year on commercial terms by Bank of Ireland, which in turn would deal with the ECB.
The move has been approved by the board of the bank but is subject to the agreement of the shareholders.
As an interim measure, the financing of the bond will be a collateralised facility provided by NAMA to IBRC on equivalent commercial terms as the financing with Bank of Ireland. NAMA will facilitate this from its own funds.
"The net effect of this transaction is to reduce the economic cost for the State as a whole of refinancing this payment," Mr Noonan said.”
The money that Anglo Irish Bank owes to the European Central Bank is going to be paid this weekend. The money will not come out of this year’s tax receipts, thereby increasing our current deficit, it will instead be added to the national debt.”
Translation #1:
“An Insolvent State who are locked out of the bond market….
…are to issue a bond to an privately owned entity, they created with the stated goal of warehousing bad loans until the property market “recovered” to insane bubble levels (NAMA)…
…NAMA, because of their ability to issue bonds (guaranteed by an insolvent state locked out of the bond market) and their ability to flog hotels in London, are sitting on a load of cash (€4.6 Billion or something)….
…in exchange for the bond NAMA are to give €3.1 billion to a shell company, the employees and management of which, it is widely acknowledged, are guilty of Fraudulent Accounting, Criminal Negligence and successfully executing a Conspiracy to Defraud the State…
….This shell company (Anglo) will pass this cash onto the organisation tasked with control of monetary policy within the Eurozone, who in spite of this refuse to accept any blame for lack of regulation of ridiculous financial products or unreasonable credit expansion (the ECB), who will then destroy the cash because the created it out of thin air in the first place …
….In the mean time (if private shareholders agree to it) a basket case zombie bank (only existing because of a guarantee from the Insolvent State, a transfer of it’s bad loans to the Privately Owned Warehouse and the issuing of free money by the entity in charge of controlling monetary policy in the Eurozone) will give €3.1 Billion in cash to NAMA in exchange for the IOU….effectively lending the cash to the Insolvent State even though no one else will lend to the state and, anecdotally, this basket case zombie bank (Bank of Ireland) refuse to lend to otherwise viable businesses because they are sitting on unquantifiable levels of mortgage defaults that the State instructs them to ignore.”
Translation #2:
”Well….surprisingly, the insanity didn’t work….here’s some more stop gap insanity to keep you amused whilst we hope for the best.”
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From :
bigtom
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Posted : 30/03/12 at 14:56 |
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| One good thing about the property crash: Damien English on the Vincent Browne show. "No no no hold on there Vincent, no hold on, what you said there, which is what he said now and I have to say my understanding of it now is that the whole thing has been flawed, at a FUNDAMENTAL LEVEL, no hold on now Vincent, no hold on there now and let me finish my point, no hold on, which is the one thing we can all be clear on, and let there be no confusion about this, which is to say that my understanding of it now is that we don't intend to ever pay this money back. And that's my understanding of it, having spoken to NO HOLD ON NOW VINCENT, and let's be clear on this, I never said that Vincent, I never said that now you're putting words in my mouth and as Enda Kenny has repeatedly said, on a number of occasions, and if you'd just let me make my point Vincent, which is that the mess that this Government inherited from the Fianna Fail party, and let's be clear on this, which is what Minister Noonan intends to do... We're not to blame for any of this, Vincent."
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From :
number10
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Posted : 31/03/12 at 14:07 |
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Thank you for the elucidation, Evil. I think I will have to draw a picture, or a graph or something, to be sure that I am following it all correctly!
The convoluted madness of it is one thing, but can you tell us where the benefits are (allegedly) and what the savings will be (allegedly)?
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From :
tricky
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Posted : 12/06/12 at 13:45 |
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So is Peter Bacon the biggest hack for sale going ?
he thought it up, he's then helping guys in a case against it.
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 07/08/12 at 08:51 |
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So ye heard about the NAMA employee who bought a gaff off a guy who was in NAMA at a discount of something close to 80% of its notional peak (2007) value, without any “competitive bidding process” yeah?
Guess what he’s doing now? Go on, guess.
Article published on April Fool’s Day 2012. A thing of beauty.
http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/nama-says-its-not- worried-as-manager-quits-for-fund-3067656.html
“Nama says it's not worried as manager quits for fund
Sunday April 01 2012
GIANT UK private equity firm Forum Partners has hired former Nama executive Enda Farrell to scour the Irish market for distressed debt deals.
Forum Partners is a €5bn real estate investment management firm, with operations in the US, Europe and Asia.
Mr Farrell was a portfolio manager at Nama before the move to the private equity company.
Fears that Forum Partners might benefit from Mr Farrell's inside knowledge of Nama were dismissed by the state agency, which is selling €80bn worth of property assets to investors.
A Nama spokesman told the Sunday Independent that no properties are sold without a competitive bidding process and that all properties are independently valued before any sale. All sales are also reviewed by the Comptroller & Auditor-General's office.
Top civil servants are restricted from moving to private sector jobs in areas where they may have specialist knowledge.
Civil servants must spend a year in "quarantine" before taking up these jobs.
Forum announced last week that it was shifting its focus to concentrate on European debt markets. The company is seeking to capitalise on the difficulties banks have with distressed borrowers.
"Enda will perform a number of roles for Forum, including sourcing loans from Irish financial institutions, creating new products for investment in Ireland and helping Crown [a Forum investment] build their loan servicing platform for Irish banks," according to Forum.
- Nick Webb”
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 07/08/12 at 08:53 |
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...oh, and his wife works for Ernst and Young.
(See list on page one of this thread....and and any article about warehousing of directors' loans at Anglo)
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From :
number10
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Posted : 07/08/12 at 13:52 |
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Keep it up, sleuth.
The mind boggles. Seriously it does.
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From :
tricky
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Posted : 07/08/12 at 15:20 |
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| it's like when the fall of communism happened in Russia and all this 'insiders' picked over the carcass to become super rich.
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 12/10/12 at 14:08 |
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NAMA Tribunal anyone?
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2012/1012/122 4325186777.html
Former Nama executive sent data to leading firms
FORMER NATIONAL Asset Management Agency (Nama) executive Enda Farrell sent information, allegedly misappropriated from the State agency, in emails to professionals in Dublin, London, Paris, Berlin and Amsterdam, he has told the Commercial Court in documents.
Among those emailed were executives at the property investment division of French insurance giant Axa and US company Fidelity International, two of the world’s biggest investment groups.
The insurance company’s property division is the largest real-estate fund in Europe, managing assets of more than €42 billion.
Fidelity is the world’s fifth-biggest property fund manager.
Nama is claiming in a Commercial Court case that information about loans and the ownership of properties supporting those loans were unlawfully deployed in the commercial property market.
Mr Farrell, a property portfolio analyst with Nama until he resigned in February 2012, said he forwarded emails to his wife, Alice Kramer, who worked in Ernst Young advising on compliance and she sent the emails on to her personal Yahoo email account.
Mr Farrell said in affidavits that while at Nama that he sent an email with information in October 2011 to Fabian Neuenschwander, an employee of a Swiss investment manager, The Partners Group.
That month, he sent information by email to Borge Tangeraas, a consultant to property investor FREO Group in Amsterdam.
He also emailed information to Jos Short, owner of real-estate investment manager Internos in London, in January 2012.
On January 11th, he emailed information to Denis Morel, a fund manager at Axa Real Estate Investment Managers in Paris, and sent the same email to Axa executives Jean Michel Rossi, Laurent Vouin, and Harry Badham in London.
David Jackson and Peter Riley of PRUPIM Real Estate Investment Managers in London received emails on January 16th.
After Mr Farrell left Nama and while employed as a consultant for six months with UK private equity property firm Forum Partners, he sent emails from March 30th to April 17th to Neil Cable, head of European real estate investments at Fidelity in London and Darren Ehlert, managing director of IN-West Immobilien in Berlin, which was affiliated to Forum.
He also sent information in an email to Andrew Walker in April at the European branch of Forum.
Irish recipients of emailed information from Mr Farrell include Bobby Geraghty of estate agents King Associates in Dublin who received material last April.
Mr Farrell sent emails in May to Ken Rouse and Stewart Doyle of QED Equity Solutions, an investment company based at the IFSC in Dublin. Financier Dermot Desmond and former Irish Nationwide chairman Michael Walsh are listed as directors of the company.
Mr Rouse received further emails in June and July this year.
Ray McMahon, who ran the Irish business of Canadian asset manager Canaccord Genuity in Dublin, received emails in June.
Another recipient was Tony Waters, managing director of a chartered surveyors firm, HWBC, on Harcourt Street in Dublin.
Details of the Nama information and the identities of a small number of other recipients cannot be disclosed by court order.
Mr Farrell said he made no financial gain from supplying the information and has co-operated with Nama and National Treasury Management Agency since they took legal action against him.
Mr Justice Peter Kelly was told in court this week that Mr Farrell and his wife have co-operated with Nama’s investigation, while those who received information indicated they intended to co-operate.
The case has been adjourned.
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From :
number10
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Posted : 12/10/12 at 16:57 |
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| I read this today with mounting incredulity. Like, how could the man be so fucking stupid?
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From :
evil_giraffe
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Posted : 12/10/12 at 17:13 |
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Stupid?
Uh. I'm quite sure he knew exactly what he was doing.
I don't want to defame the guy. Or incite violence. Well. Actually. I really, really do.
Michael Collins had people like him shot.
The Irish Free State now pay them obscene salaries.
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